Critical undersea cables and pipelines are increasingly vulnerable to sabotage by geopolitical rivals, adding a new threat dimension to competition in the Baltic Sea and elsewhere. Such "gray zone" tactics allow adversaries to test NATO resolve without triggering open conflict. What are the legal and military challenges of protecting infrastructure that lies outside clear territorial boundaries? And how can Western governments deter further disruption?

In this episode, Paul Saunders speaks with Martha Miller, a Senior Fellow at the Center for the National Interest. Miller recently served as deputy executive director of the National Security Institute at the Antonin Scalia Law School and was a special assistant to President George W. Bush. She also held national security roles in the U.S. Senate and the U.S. State Department.

Music by  ...