WhyWork Podcast

WhyWork Podcast

by Alan Girle, Trajce Cvetkovski, & Sara Pazell

Management Social Sciences

Season 6

S06 E09: IRL? In Real Life? Software solutions and AI in work design

Season 06 Episode 09: IRL? In Real Life? Software solutions and AI in work design Trajce struggles with the ideas of ‘flow efficiency,’ likening this to urine tract functioning. Sorry, Anna Linning - a subscriber who asked about ‘flow’… Alan connects the idea to Flo’s scones, Flo Bjelke-Petersen’s famous pumpkin scones. Sara brings the boys back around to discuss psychological flow, theories from Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi, and links these ideas to job redesign and software solutions. She shares one of the ViVA team’s software solution partners, “Beam me up with Beamible” for agile job design with what-if scenarios and cost analytics to build a business case. Alan tongue twists the word, “discombobulated” because of interrupted workflows, while he shares content on legilsative obligations of company directors. Sara provides a human factors perspective on interruptions - about 20 minutes of task reorientation. She gives the example of nurses getting interrupted during medication administration and the risks for administration error. Sara talks about information and business architecture while organisations grow organically like a wild beast. The design objective, she explains, is to aim for ‘reliability with resilience’ – the right ‘tensions’, the ‘R&R Tensions.’ The conversation takes a twist as Sara discusses her brother’s, Robert’s, lectures in Artificial Intelligence (AI) and the historic development of AI from the 1950’s. Sara mentions more of ViVA’s tech partners, Lachlan Phillips of livemind.ai, develops closed-domain data support systems, and Real Serious Games for extended reality solutions. She recalls a conversation with Lachlan who asks her about doing a joint presentation, “IRL?” “In real life?” – like there needs to be an acronym to distinguish the real versus virtual world.

S06 E08: The sentinel gateway – keeper of the path ahead

Season 06 Episode 08: The sentinel gateway - keeper of the path ahead WARNING: This episode discusses a workplace fatality - listener discretion is advised. Alan shares an industrial safety law case involving the disrepair of a gate, which prompts Trajce to reflect on his early-career prosecution of an industrial gate failure, leading to the news headline, “Fallen gate crushes mum.” The team remark on the feasibility and severity of these events deserving serious assessment, challenging the reliance on probabilistic risk assessments versus consequence. Sara shares a work reality of the difficulty of industrial gate use, especially as a visitor unfamiliar with the urban layout. Trajce solves the problems of reaching industrial gate activation panels from the window of his sportscar by using his selfie stick, causing the team to burst in laughter. “It’s funny, right?” Sara asks, “The language, ‘you’re off your rails’ implies that someone is acting unpredictably, and that they are out of control. Similarly, a gate off its sliding rail, demands some serious intervention. Trajce uses these ideas in lyrical recall of gate-related song titles.

S06 E07: We revisit the right to disconnect

Season 06 Episode 07 - We revisit the right to disconnect. Trajce provokes conversation on the Fair Work Amendment (Right to Disconnect) Bill 2023 among the team again. Sara asks, “Why did we throw legislation at this? I want to know - how did they develop their problem statements? Is this legislation really hitting the mark? Are there system designs to protect workers versus needing to rely on legislation to advance these rights when the world of work has moved on from the 9 to 5pm, five day a week, patriarchal workplace?" “Court is the last resort,” marvels Trajce, “But I think these sensible measures are failing.” Alan explains the origins of these laws, protective of schoolteachers and principals. She asks about why we did not pivot, leverage a rich opportunity in the pandemic, to radically review how and where education is delivered to schoolchildren. Trajce agrees, “Maybe the parents might be less stressed too!” Sara pontificates on workplace rhythms and tribal culture. She speaks about the top level of Maslow’s Hierarchy, activities that inspire, elevate, and meet aspirations. Sara explains Charlie Grantham theories on work-life balance versus aspirations that require work intensification: wellness, wellbeing, and wholeness. This episode includes some remix of S05 E03: Grab the Pilates socks - its our 'Right to Disconnect' time!

S06 E06: Scope creep and Snag-arees

Season 06 Episode 06: Scope creep and Snag-arees WARNING: This episode includes sexual inferences. “The power of the beep is getting to Trajce’s head,” says Alan. “This is a very serious podcast,” Trajce protests. The cause for the bleep is revealed: “Oh my gosh,” Sara says through laughter, “There is a ‘snag, drag, and bag’ phrase online describing people pulling fish out of the ocean, a ‘snag drag queen’,” she jeers, while exclaiming that, “This is a ‘snag-aree’!” Trajce gets back to case law, telling a story about a newly-appointed receptionist at a UK law firm. He describes all the ‘extra work’ she takes on, resulting in work conflict. Sara comments, “This sounds like ‘scope creep’." Sara reports on a media story about the covert reenactment of a congested hospital ER system during a ministerial visit. “A spurious scenario re-enactment?” Trajce is incredulous. Alan exclaims, “Like the boy who cried wolf!” Sara reminds subscribers that these stories are the reason why she and other chapter authors developed the Healthcare Insights book. For more about the origins of the bleep and snag-aree conversation, listen to Season 05 Episode 05: Shimmyin' on the dance floor .

S06 E05: I spy with my little eye

Season 06 Episode 05: I spy with my little eye Sara introduces the topics of ‘design for crime’ and surveillance systems with predictive analytics generated by artificial intelligence. Alan speaks about his experiences with intelligent surveillance systems and their ability to see, feel, hear, and determine responses. Alan explains that business must establish their purpose and context when using video surveillance before consulting legal teams. “Bingo!” exclaims Sara, “Explain the design brief.” Alan presents a work health and safety case in which the regulator charged a work health and safety manager for their alleged inadequate development of a work procedure. “Wait, WHAaaaT?” questions Sara, “This will rattle the industry because workplaces encourage worker involvement in developing procedures – it is fundamental consultation.” Alan explains that this is a hallmark case, marking a new area for the intrusion of work health and safety legislation. “There is a high level of immunity for health & safety representatives and government-approved work health and safety officers, but at any other level a worker’s involvement represents risk exposure.” “What a discouragement,” resigns Trajce.

S06 E04: A bonza boom & crash: Decommissioning with dignity

Season 06 Episode 04: A bonza boom & crash: Decommissioning with dignity Trajce and Sara compliment Alan’s dress sense - smooth, Italian, Mafioso, modelled after a Kappa soccer sports brand, while Sara reflects on her ‘rugby mum’ look for the day. Trajce teases Sara with her unlaced shoes in contemporary gangsta-fashion, primed for larceny. “It’s a sport and leather vibe,” says Trajce. Trajce contemplates the need to evaluate a design journey, going beyond the pointy end of an event with direct causational pathways. “A designer is a parent of consequences,” he declares. The crew focus on examples of decommissioning in design phases. “Deconditioning with dignity,” Trajce phrases.

S06 E03: Roger rabbit, reconciling responsibilities: Who’s job is it anyway?

Season 06 Episode 03: Roger rabbit, reconciling responsibilities: Who’s job is it anyway? WARNING: This episode discusses road safety fatal hazard exposures and construction failures. “A cream bun goes a long way for you,” Alan teases Trajce when Trajce admits that he could never prosecute a baker. Alan describes a work health and safety legal case when a football club grandstand roof collapsed during construction. The construction workers were fortunate to avoid significant injuries. Sara regales a story about her drive home from her son’s rugby practice when a car sped past theirs travelling up the wrong side of their neighbouring lane. She adds to the story with another event - a car collision that no one wanted to clean up. “Who’s job is it anyway?” asks Trajce, as he examines the confronting idea of false comforts, “In systems, we blindly trust,” he says.

S06 E02: An uppy or a downy

Season 06 Episode 02: An uppy or a downy WARNING: This episode includes discussion about the fatality of a child. “Are you an ‘Uppy’ or a ‘Downy’?” asks Alan. “We have reached the lowest watermark on the show here,” says Trajce Alan is entertained by Sara’s social media post about universal in public facilities. “Are we living for design or are we designed for living?” queries Trajce. “Exactly!” exclaims Sara, “Design shapes behaviours.” Alan introduces the idea of prosecution of designers. Trajce pontificates on causational chains of responsibilities. Sara recalls a media-reported incident of a badminton racquet malfunction and splintering that allegedly caused the fatality of a child. She advocates for human factors approaches when integrating technologies in work systems.

S06 E01: Special Release - Extended Episode: Good design strategy in mining: Section 22 – ‘Don’t overcook the chook’

Warning: This episode discusses workplace fatalities and complex injuries Season 06 Episode 01 is a special release extended episode, recorded live on stage at the Mechanical Engineering Safety Seminar 2024 sponsored by the New South Wales Resources Regulator (NSW MESS 2024). The WhyWork Podcast rabble rousers, Alan Girle, Trajce Cvetkovski, and Sara Pazell wrestle with the idea of good design strategy in mining. “Section 22,” prompts Alan, referring to the Australian Work Health and Safety Act sections 22, 23, 24, 25(4) – “…give adequate information, including any conditions necessary to ensure safe use of the plant.” Sara seeks statements from members of the audience in this live recording at the NSW Mechanical Engineering Safety Seminar 2024 on some recent design-related system failures in mining with mobile plant. The team debate these issues, including recent case law. Alan shares his ideas on the consequences of being placed under investigation. The team consider the sections of the law pertaining to design provisions and pit them against what is reasonable and practicable. Listen to Trajce get excited over his latest jurisprudential project on “proximate causation.” The podcasters discuss the risk of under-design in systems and the ‘over-design’ in some technologies with plenty of bling that might not solve the intended problems. “Don’t overcook the chook!” exclaims Trajce. “Is it fail safe or safe-to-fail design strategy?” asks Alan. The team explore these differences in philosophy, use cases, and design approaches. They consider a holistic approach to design thinking: the context; the environment; the task; the machinery; the operator; the work system; the job design; the management; the governance and regulations; and the people, pedestrians or other vehicle and plant operators, around the machinery that might act in unpredictable ways. Sara advises the team on her strategy to prompt this deep thinking in organisations when adopting new technologies or constructing new environments by asking three simple questions, “Is there a way?” “Can you play?” and “Can you stay?” She waxes lyrical about the enduring impact of good design and her passion to help organisations get this right if they want to achieve resilience, productivity, and sustain their desirable health and safety outcomes. This episode presents ideas on: Design thinking and design strategy in mining Case review on mining equipment and system design Investigating design-related equipment and system flaws System design and resilience, closing the communication loop on design-related realities to cause ongoing improvements Note: The WhyWhork Podcast sends a special shout out to Dr Martin Stirling of HILTI Australia for his useful explanations on being a “value engineer” and “co-operation”, Japanese style, in his conversations with Trajce. We love your work!

S06 Trailer 06: An 'uppy or a downy'

Season 06 Trailer 06: An uppy or a downy - potty talk prep - WhaAAT? We've reached the lowest watermark - prelude.

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