🔥 Follow Me to the M-R-O-P! | Podcast on RSS.com

🔥 Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!

🔥 Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!

by Brian Mueller

Education Christianity

Season 1

Episode #38 feat. Brad Pickel

What happens when a highly successful, workaholic D.C. lobbyist realizes his career can no longer be his entire spiritual journey? In this thirty-eighth episode of Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!, host Brian Mueller sits down with Brad Pickel, an Enneagram 3, coastal scientist, and the former administrator for Illuman from 2014 to 2021. Brad shares his journey to the "Rainy MROP" of 2011 in Rolling Ridge, West Virginia—the very last rites of passage led by Richard Rohr. He discusses sweeping out stinkbugs from his uninsulated cabin, the fear of losing his marriage if the rites changed him too much, and his wife Leslie's beautiful, loving response to his anxiety. Episode Highlights The Rainy MROP: Brad recalls the muddy, stinkbug-filled, 100-man initiation in West Virginia, and how the challenging weather mirrored his internal path of descent. Healing the Father Wound: Brad discusses letting go of his attachments and finding the grace to see his estranged, dying father simply as a broken man. The Yellow Eyes in the Woods: A powerful story from his nature solo, and how Brad's relationship with the "wild" shifted from a feeling of strict discipline to an invitation to wander freely. A Call to Service: What it was like to serve as Illuman's first administrator, fielding desperate emails from hungry men and honoring the profound vulnerability of the brotherhood. Links & Resources Brad Pickel (Guest) Brian Mueller (Host) BriansPoems.com Illuman MROP Choosing Presence (Sponsor) Practicing Presence App The Universal Christ by Richard Rohr Adam's Return by Richard Rohr Breathing Under Water by Richard Rohr Trust Stillness by Brian Mueller Credits First and foremost, thank you to Brad Pickel for sharing his journey and his heart with us today. Thank you to Fr. Richard Rohr and the men of Illuman who have stewarded the Men’s Rites of Passage since 1996. Music Credits: Slow Mo Dreams by Soundroll Becoming a Legend by Vens Adams

Episode #37 feat. Byron McMillan

What happens when a successful director of missions at a mega-church realizes his faith tradition is broken and he's carrying decades of internalized oppression? In this thirty-seventh episode of Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!, host Brian Mueller sits down with Byron McMillan, a true contemplative, outdoor educator, and guide at the Center for Action and Contemplation. Byron shares his profoundly moving journey from the evangelical South to a 2017 initiation at Sky High Ranch in Colorado. Episode Highlights Deconstructing Faith: Why Byron left his dream job at a 10,000-person mega-church after recognizing its complicity in systemic racism and political idolatry. A Vision of Harriet Tubman: Sitting in the rain during his six-hour nature solo, Byron received a powerful message from the great abolitionist: "Trust the earth." The Gauntlet: Byron describes the agonizing but liberating experience of walking through two lines of men and announcing his core wound of racial inadequacy. The Great Turning: Why American culture is like an adolescent caterpillar destroying the planet, and how the men of Illuman are acting as "imaginal cells" to birth a new way of being. Links & Resources Byron McMillan (Guest) Elder Fire Collective Brian Mueller (Host) BriansPoems.com Illuman MROP Choosing Presence (Sponsor) Practicing Presence App The Universal Christ by Richard Rohr Adam's Return by Richard Rohr Breathing Under Water by Richard Rohr Trust Stillness by Brian Mueller Credits First and foremost, thank you to Byron McMillan for sharing his journey and his heart with us today. Thank you to Fr. Richard Rohr and the men of Illuman who have stewarded the Men’s Rites of Passage since 1996. Thank you to Jim Heaney and Jim Taylor for their dedication to Choosing Presence. Music Credits: Slow Mo Dreams by Soundroll Becoming a Legend by Vens Adams

Episode #36 feat. Matthew Burch

What happens when a father takes his teenage son to a youth rites of passage, only to discover that he desperately needs an initiation of his own? In this thirty-sixth episode of Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!, host Brian Mueller sits down with Matthew Burch, a small business owner from Oklahoma City, who made his rites at DeRoche, British Columbia in 2024. Matthew shares a beautifully articulate and profound story of stumbling into men's work after a decade of non-stop grinding at his business, and how taking his 15-year-old son to the youth rites cracked him wide open. Episode Highlights A Father's Awakening: How taking his 15-year-old son to a youth rites of passage led Matthew to weep tears of joy for four straight hours on the drive home—and realize he needed his own initiation. Beyond the Warrior: Realizing he had spent his life using the "Warrior" archetype to fight and defend himself, and how the rites opened him up to the tenderness, vulnerability, and nurturing of other masculine archetypes. Healing Trust: Overcoming a lifetime of distrust toward men and authority figures—stemming from an absent biological father and a fraught relationship with his stepfather—by forming deep, safe bonds with his council brothers. Links & Resources Brian Mueller (Host) BriansPoems.com Illuman MROP Illuman of Texas/Oklahoma Choosing Presence (Sponsor) Practicing Presence App The Universal Christ by Richard Rohr Adam's Return by Richard Rohr Breathing Under Water by Richard Rohr Trust Stillness by Brian Mueller Credits First and foremost, thank you to Matthew Burch for sharing his journey and his heart with us today. Thank you to Fr. Richard Rohr and the men of Illuman who have stewarded the Men’s Rites of Passage since 1996. Thank you to Jim Heaney and Jim Taylor for their dedication to Choosing Presence. Music Credits: Slow Mo Dreams by Soundroll Becoming a Legend by Vens Adams

Episode #35 feat. Joe Grilliot

What happens when a Catholic priest steps away from his vocation, moves to the cornfields of Ohio, and seeks out a new kind of spiritual initiation? In this thirty-fifth episode of Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!, host Brian Mueller sits down with Joe Grilliot to discuss his June 2025 initiation at Osprey Wilds in Sandstone, Minnesota. Joe, a former priest turned farmer, shares his journey of navigating a major life transition—from ministry to marriage, fatherhood, and farming—and why he sought out the rites to make an intentional transition into true manhood. Episode Highlights Ticks as Teachers: Joe recounts his solo time in the wilderness, where avoiding ticks and mosquitoes taught him how to push through his fear with humor. A Unique Crossroads: The massive life transition that brought Joe to the rites: leaving the priesthood, getting married, having a son during COVID, and becoming a farmer in Ohio. The Ritual Bond: The powerful, immediate connection Joe formed with his partner, John, during their very first ritual on Friday night. A Broader Sacramentality: How Joe's background as a Catholic priest influenced his experience, and how the rites helped him realize God's presence extends far beyond specific words and rituals. Fatherhood and the Live Edge: Joe's ongoing work to manage his anger—a trait inherited from his own father on the farm—so he can be a healthier, safer presence for his young son. Links & Resources Brian Mueller (Host) BriansPoems.com Illuman MROP Choosing Presence (Sponsor) Practicing Presence App The Universal Christ by Richard Rohr Adam's Return by Richard Rohr Breathing Under Water by Richard Rohr Trust Stillness by Brian Mueller Credits First and foremost, thank you to Joe Grilliot for sharing his journey and his heart with us today. Thank you to Fr. Richard Rohr and the men of Illuman who have stewarded the Men’s Rites of Passage since 1996. Thank you to Jim Heaney and Jim Taylor for their dedication to Choosing Presence. Music Credits: Slow Mo Dreams by Soundroll Becoming a Legend by Vens Adams

Episode #34 feat. Bob Colaresi (Encore)

What happens when a highly successful, Enneagram 3 Carmelite priest confesses to being an "inadequate son" and strips down in the woods? In this special encore presentation of Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!, host Brian Mueller brings back his conversation with Bob Colaresi. As Brian heads to the Illinois Men's Rites of Passage this week, we revisit Bob's powerful 2005 initiation in Minnesota. Bob, the founder emeritus of these rites, shares his journey of overcoming his fear of mosquitoes, discovering the profound impact of drumming, and confronting the false self that drove his messianic need to fix everything. Episode Highlights The Mosquito Fear: Bob admits he almost backed out of the rites after reading Adam's Return, only to be lovingly guilted into going by his spiritual director, Susan, who made him a drum. The Inadequate Son: How a profound grief ritual forced an Enneagram 3 administrator to publicly name the deep inadequacy driving his worldly success. Heaven Smiled: Spending a day in the woods on the three-year anniversary of his father's funeral, Bob finally heard the words he had waited his whole life to hear. Moses and the Veil: The powerful story of returning home in tears, and Susan's beautiful recognition that she had looked right into the heart of his soul. Dropping the Messianic Complex: How the rites helped Bob stop treating people like projects to be fixed and instead listen to them with genuine, self-emptying love. Links & Resources Brian Mueller (Host) BriansPoems.com Illuman MROP Choosing Presence (Sponsor) Practicing Presence App The Universal Christ by Richard Rohr Adam's Return by Richard Rohr Breathing Under Water by Richard Rohr Trust Stillness by Brian Mueller Credits First and foremost, thank you to Bob Colaresi for sharing his journey and his heart with us today. Thank you to Fr. Richard Rohr and the men of Illuman who have stewarded the Men’s Rites of Passage since 1996. Thank you to Jim Heaney and Jim Taylor for their dedication to Choosing Presence. Music Credits: Slow Mo Dreams by Soundroll Becoming a Legend by Vens Adams

Episode #33 feat. Chester Trocha (Encore)

What happens when a corporate executive caught in the rat race sits in silence by a pond and finally lets his guard down? In this special encore presentation of Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!, host Brian Mueller brings back his very first conversation on the podcast with Chester Trocha. As Brian heads to the Illinois Men's Rites of Passage this week to stand with the men crossing the threshold, we revisit Chester's powerful 2012 initiation at Pilgrim Park. Chester, a co-convener for Illuman of Illinois, shares his journey of leaving behind the superficial containers of the corporate world to discover a deeper spiritual churning. Guided by the wisdom of Weaver Belden Lane, Chester recalls the profound impact of intentional rituals, the beauty of a diverse council group featuring a Franciscan friar and a Mennonite minister, and the uncontainable joy that led him to buy coffee for a stranger on the drive home. Episode Highlights The First Encounter: Reliving the very first episode of the podcast as a special encore presentation. Belden Lane's Wisdom: The incredible impact of nature, silence, and an authentic storyteller. Sobbing by the Pond: The overwhelming mix of emotions Chester experienced immediately after the rites concluded. The Starbucks Joy: Driving home and feeling an uncontainable happiness that spilled over to a stranger. The Slow Burn: How the rites initiated a slow spiritual churning that led to daily centering prayer and the CAC's Living School. Links & Resources Brian Mueller (Host) BriansPoems.com Illuman MROP Choosing Presence (Sponsor) Practicing Presence App The Universal Christ by Richard Rohr Adam's Return by Richard Rohr Breathing Under Water by Richard Rohr Trust Stillness by Brian Mueller Credits First and foremost, thank you to Chester Trocha for sharing his journey and his heart with us today. Thank you to Fr. Richard Rohr and the men of Illuman who have stewarded the Men’s Rites of Passage since 1996. Thank you to Jim Heaney and Jim Taylor for their dedication to Choosing Presence. Music Credits: Slow Mo Dreams by Soundroll Becoming a Legend by Vens Adams

Episode #32 feat. Steve Duncan

What happens when you retire and realize you don't have any in-depth male relationships outside of your professional life? In this thirty-second episode of Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!, host Brian Mueller sits down with Steve Duncan to discuss his 2015 initiation at Camp Tamarack in Northern California. Steve shares his journey of taking a huge leap of faith into men's work, arriving at the rites in a carpool "clown car," and the transformative power of vulnerability. Episode Highlights The Leap of Faith: How retiring and wanting a deeper relationship with his new son-in-law led Steve to seek out male connection. Supported in the Struggle: Steve recalls a deeply moving moment during a physical ritual when a team member gently supported him. Awakening to Contemplation: How the first morning sit around a campfire opened the door to a rich, ongoing contemplative practice. MROP vs. Elder Rites: Steve compares the multi-generational bonding of his men's rites to the profound, specific grief work of the Elder Rites. Holding the Thread: A beautiful reflection on William Stafford's poem "The Way It Is," and why Steve's marriage is the thread that keeps him grounded. Links & Resources Brian Mueller (Host) BriansPoems.com Illuman MROP Choosing Presence (Sponsor) Practicing Presence App The Universal Christ by Richard Rohr Adam's Return by Richard Rohr Breathing Under Water by Richard Rohr Trust Stillness by Brian Mueller Credits First and foremost, thank you to Steve Duncan for sharing his journey and his heart with us today. Thank you to Fr. Richard Rohr and the men of Illuman who have stewarded the Men’s Rites of Passage since 1996. Thank you to Jim Heaney and Jim Taylor for their dedication to Choosing Presence. Music Credits: Slow Mo Dreams by Soundroll Becoming a Legend by Vens Adams

Episode #31 feat. Nine Lives with Jeff King

Why am I sharing an episode from another podcast on our feed? Because understanding the Enneagram is an incredibly powerful tool for the masculine spiritual journey—and I wanted to share a conversation that dives deep into it! Rest assured, there is also plenty of relevant discussion here about Illuman and the Men's Rites of Passage. In this special thirty-first episode of Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!, the tables are turned as host Brian Mueller becomes the guest on Nine Lives with Jeff King: Live Your Best One. Jeff, a counselor and coach with the Narrative Enneagram, interviews Brian about his experience navigating life, faith, and community as an Enneagram Type One (The Reformer). Episode Highlights The Enneagram as a Spiritual Tool: Why understanding your personality type is essential for growth, and how the "Type One" drive for perfection can be both a gift and a heavy burden. What is Mine to Do?: Learning to discern the difference between healthy responsibility and codependent fixing. The Origins of Illuman: Brian reflects on Richard Rohr’s early New Jerusalem community in Cincinnati, the history of the MROP, and the deep, universal hunger for authentic brotherhood. Poetry and the type 1-to-4 connection: How stepping into creative expression through mystic poetry allowed Brian to silence his inner critic and process the grief of his divorce Choosing Presence: Reclaiming meditation and contemplative prayer as a deeply Western, Christian tradition of the heart. Links & Resources Jeff King Nine Lives with Jeff King (podcast) Brian Mueller (Host) BriansPoems.com Illuman MROP The Universal Christ by Richard Rohr Adam's Return by Richard Rohr Breathing Under Water by Richard Rohr Trust Stillness by Brian Mueller Credits First and foremost, thank you to Jeff King for allowing me to share an episode of his podcast - Nine Lives with Jeff King: Live Your Best One. Thank you to Fr. Richard Rohr and the men of Illuman who have stewarded the Men’s Rites of Passage since 1996. Music Credits: Slow Mo Dreams by Soundroll Becoming a Legend by Vens Adams

Episode #30 feat. Mike Clawson

What happens when you spend five years pouring your heart and soul into building a business, only to have it completely fall apart through no fault of your own? In this thirtieth episode of Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!, host Brian Mueller sits down with Mike Clawson from Austin, Texas, to discuss his 2022 initiation at Johnsonburg, New Jersey. Mike opens up about arriving at the rites carrying the heavy grief of a lost "passion project" and a suddenly unmoored identity. As a former administrator for Illuman, Mike offers a unique behind-the-scenes perspective on the organization, while reflecting on the challenges of dropping his own guard to be truly vulnerable with other men. Episode Highlights The Disorienting Loss: Navigating the grief of a failed business venture and learning that "it is possible to commit no mistakes and still lose." Lover and Magician: Why the MROP focuses more on the emotional depth of the Lover and Magician archetypes, rather than the traditional King and Warrior energies. The Rain and the Woods: The somatic, visceral power of sitting alone in the freezing rain to excavate unresolved grief. Human Work vs. Men's Work: Mike’s perspective on why the inner work of the rites transcends gender, even if men specifically need a male-only container to feel safe enough to begin it. Redefining Ikigai: Shifting away from the Western obsession with "grand purpose" to find meaning in the simple, everyday things that get you out of bed. Links & Resources Brian Mueller (Host) BriansPoems.com Illuman MROP Choosing Presence (Sponsor) Practicing Presence App The Universal Christ by Richard Rohr Adam's Return by Richard Rohr Breathing Under Water by Richard Rohr Trust Stillness by Brian Mueller Credits First and foremost, thank you to Mike Clawson for sharing his journey and his heart with us today. Thank you to Fr. Richard Rohr and the men of Illuman who have stewarded the Men’s Rites of Passage since 1996. Thank you to Jim Heaney and Jim Taylor for their dedication to Choosing Presence. Music Credits: Slow Mo Dreams by Soundroll Becoming a Legend by Vens Adams

Episode #29 feat. Jay Gallamore

What happens when a retired naval pilot—who used to schedule his Saturday naps days in advance—steps out of his head and into his heart? In this twenty-ninth episode of Follow Me to the M-R-O-P!, host Brian Mueller sits down with Jay Gallamore to discuss his 2024 initiation at Shrine Mont, Virginia. Jay shares his journey of navigating PTSD, divorce, and the unraveling of his life, ultimately finding a tighter steering wheel for his spiritual path through Illuman. He opens up about the shock of the "mirror gauntlet," balancing his "three buckets" of life, and why the radical inclusivity of men's work needs to consciously make space for military veterans and first responders. Episode Highlights The Wide Road: How hitting rock bottom with PTSD and a crumbling marriage sparked a profound spiritual journey. The Mirror Gauntlet: The emotional shock of witnessing the deep childhood wounds of other men during ritual. Head to Heart: Transitioning from a highly analytical, schedule-driven life to a grounded morning meditation practice. Military Men & Radical Belonging: A candid discussion on the tension conservative or military men might feel in progressive spiritual spaces, and the need for true inclusion. The Three Buckets: Learning the hard way to balance family, religion, and volunteer work without overcommitting. Links & Resources Brian Mueller (Host) BriansPoems.com Illuman MROP Choosing Presence (Sponsor) Practicing Presence App The Universal Christ by Richard Rohr Adam's Return by Richard Rohr Breathing Under Water by Richard Rohr Trust Stillness by Brian Mueller Credits First and foremost, thank you to Jay Gallamore for sharing his journey and his heart with us today. Thank you to Fr. Richard Rohr and the men of Illuman who have stewarded the Men’s Rites of Passage since 1996. Thank you to Jim Heaney and Jim Taylor for their dedication to Choosing Presence. Music Credits: Slow Mo Dreams by Soundroll Becoming a Legend by Vens Adams

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