In Episode 3 of They Tried It, Lindiwe Davis sits down with Jenny Chen (“J Chen”), a first-generation Chinese Canadian immigrant, former wealth management DEI leader, and founder of Catalais Consulting, to unpack what happens when workplace culture punishes authenticity, rewrites the definition of “leadership,” and rewards toxic authority.

This conversation gets specific about how toxic environments operate: leaders who confuse authority with leadership, workplaces that protect high performers who harm others, and the quiet ways professionals end up switching jobs for self-preservation. Jenny and Lindiwe also discuss what actually helps you move forward when a manager is blocking you, building visibility beyond your reporting line, expanding your network, and “switching lanes” when ...