In this raw and powerful episode of Off Topic But On Point, Odette de Beer sits down with Dr. Janine Do Cabo and Pastor Christo Pretorius to unpack the unglamorous side of obedience, leadership, and purpose-driven work.

This isn’t a highlight reel—it’s the conversation most leaders avoid. Together, they dive into the emotional cost of conviction, why influence without depth feels empty, and how to keep showing up when no one’s clapping. If you've ever wondered whether you're behind, off track, or just tired of waiting for the "breakthrough moment"—this one’s for you.

Whether you're leading a business, building something from scratch, or quietly staying faithful behind the scenes, this episode reminds you: you’re not late—and you’re not alone.

What you'll hear:

• Why obedience rarely lo ...