Today we’re joined by Philip Piper, CEO & Co-Founder of Swarm (Swarm Markets) a builder at the intersection of DeFi, real-world assets (RWA) and regulated market infrastructure. In this forward-looking conversation with host Rupert Pickering (All In Crypto), Philip explains why we’re still in “Mickey Mouse land” for on-chain markets and why the next phase could bring trillions of traditional assets on-chain, surpassing even Bitcoin’s adoption curve.

We break down the (paused) U.S. market structure bill, the tokenization of gold as an unexpected RWA growth driver, privacy vs. surveillance in transparent ledgers, and Swarm’s Invenium acquisition to build  ...