A ninety-five-year-old told Jacinta she was the last of her tribe. Jacinta asked how that small body holds something so big, and she said she has to feel the loss but not go too far into it … when it gets close she goes outside and listens to the magpies. That is the whole human experience in one sentence.

In this episode we talk about the moment women become invisible, and how much earlier that lands than anyone admits. We talk about bodies, and about Jacinta's fierce insistence that we stop policing each other. She tells me what chronic illness took from her in her late twenties, and about the moment in her parents' spare room when it turned. And then she tells me about her friends in their nineties, and honestly, I want what they have.

We explore:

• The unconscious loyalties we carry, and what happens w ...